Bad Apple

[NejinOniwa]

If you were european, you'd have learned that a few years ago... ^^;

[CaptBrenden]

I mean no offence Bella, and this isnt ment as a troll etc, so calm down. If someone posts a tread about Microsoft screwing people youll get right behind it, but since its Apple suddenly its WRONG to discuss a company doing wrong things?  No one is saying this is an Apple exclusive issue, nore is it being painted as such. The article the thread is discussing however is specificly apple, and that is who we are discussing.   Dispite all the shit Microsoft gets (I would say its safe to say they catch more flak then anyother company out there, and often imo for stupid things like trying to IMPROVE customer satisfaction by providing free antivirus software if a user doesnt have any etc) Apple does just as much shady shit and personally Im glad to see some light cast on someone else for a change showing Microsoft not being the ONLY big bad out there.

Im sure we could start a thread about how much good those companies do with their profits as well, but no one would listen. I dont know about Apple, I would assume they do, but I have several close and personal friends that work for the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation (http://www.gatesfoundation.org/Pages/home.aspx) where alot of money goes out there to help the people of the world.

Corporations do shady things, they also do good things. Kinda like people that way.

On the second part, the few times I've had to try and call customer support, its when all other means and solutions have failed and it was usually beyond the tech support types at that point. I get a distinct feeling most of the time tech support exists to help.... lets just say computer illiterates most. They can provide some more advanced support, but they usually insist on going through the pre assigned trouble shooting questions, even though I can call them up and give them the exact symptom and problems.  Personally I think the support services, apple care included, are all a sham and a waste of money if you have access to the internet and tech websites. The biggest annoyance with my new dell laptop is that it has a button specificly for the "dell support center" built into it.

While I'm on that subject.. another trend thats irking the hell out of me is you dont get CDs or DVDs with new computers anymore to do fresh installs of your software. With my new dell they instead made a partition on my hard drive to store those files.

[NejinOniwa]

On my part, what I generally do when facing a troublesome part of computery is to call one of the several computer/part shops around the area. They are generally very well informed on issues with hardware especially, and I would assume with software as well (though none of that has needed any care for me that I couldn't do myself). It's a pretty easy round.

[Krizonar]

Personally I think the support services, apple care included, are all a sham and a waste of money if you have access to the internet and tech websites.

Maybe some support services, but Applecare is definitely worth having as they will even give you an identical computer if they can't fix it (unnoficial word at our Apple Stores is, if ya can't fix it in 3 tries, customer gets a new computer), for free.

Like I said before, I regret forgetting to extend my Applecare.

[Bella]

Personally I think the support services, apple care included, are all a sham and a waste of money if you have access to the internet and tech websites.

Maybe some support services, but Applecare is definitely worth having as they will even give you an identical computer if they can't fix it (unnoficial word at our Apple Stores is, if ya can't fix it in 3 tries, customer gets a new computer), for free.

Like I said before, I regret forgetting to extend my Applecare.

Agreed, I got an extended warrenty on my old Gateway notebook, and it saved me thousands of dollars worth of repairs...

-Within two weeks the hinges cracked
-Within six months the mobo and AC adapter quit
-After about a year, the hinges cracked again and the screen died
-Sometime afterward the mobo fried itself again
-IIRC the screen died another time
-It started having overheating related shutdowns

There were a few other issues too, Best Buy fixed EVERY one of these with no cost to me, AND sent me a new battery every year. That was the best $300 I've ever spent.

[Krizonar]

-Within two weeks the hinges cracked
-Within six months the mobo and AC adapter quit
-After about a year, the hinges cracked again and the screen died
-Sometime afterward the mobo fried itself again
-IIRC the screen died another time
-It started having overheating related shutdowns

There were a few other issues too,

Mother of god.

Dat Wintel PC

[Red-Machine]

I've only ever had a single issue with any of my PCs or laptops.  The Dell we got in 2007 had to be sent back the next day because the GPU died.  There's a guy I know through YouTube that's had a 100% failure rate on every Apple product he's ever owned, and he's been using Apple stuff since they started.

[Bella]

I've only ever had a single issue with any of my PCs or laptops.  The Dell we got in 2007 had to be sent back the next day because the GPU died.  There's a guy I know through YouTube that's had a 100% failure rate on every Apple product he's ever owned, and he's been using Apple stuff since they started.

I've had a 100% failure rate on every computer I've owned, except for my Intel iMac, my 128k Macintosh and my VIC-20 and C-128. -w-

[Krizonar]

I have a 100% failure rate with Sony Products. This also applies to every PC I've ever had, including one I built myself, since they have either had a catastrophic level of meltdown or blew up, hence one reason why I stopped even considering them as options when it comes to a main computer.

[Nichi]

The only brand I've had issues with is Dell, mainly with their products made after '01. Frankenstein V3 is built around an XPS from '99, and it's second only to 2k herself in raw awesomeness, while TARDIS was a Dimension desktop from '06 that had it's processor fan die, due to the stress of the Pentium 4 on top of it being a brutal summer that year)

Every other brand, no problems at all; especially with NEC. If I hadn't built 2k, I would have imported the most powerful NEC desktop I could get my hands on. since they sadly don't sell PCs in the US anymore

[Bella]

I have a 100% failure rate with Sony Products. This also applies to every PC I've ever had, including one I built myself, since they have either had a catastrophic level of meltdown or blew up, hence one reason why I stopped even considering them as options when it comes to a main computer.

It's odd, because I always thought Sony computers were inferior/poorly made, just based on anecdotal evidence ... your experiences back up that assumption.

At this point, the only brands I'd consider for a main-rig are Apple, IBM/Lenovo and Dell, based on a combination of personal experience, feedback I've heard from users and reputation for being built well, having longevity and decent customer support... 'w'

[Chocofreak13]

@bella: never said that other companies don't screw over their customers too. (hell no i'm not paying 2-300 bucks for the new windows, i'll torrent in 6 months instead >>; ) just saying that it was a bitchy thing to do. i'd be saying it if it were microsoft or linux, only linux doesn't charge so we don't have this problem. :3

@tech support: i only go to tech support as a last resort these days. when i have a community of nerds to help me, why should i need the indian guy who's telling me to downgrade from windows 7 back to vista just to fix my webcam? >>;

@computer failure: the only computers to fail me were speedy, gothpod III, and, to a lesser extent, tanky and shitty. the rest of the fleet hasn't had any extended use, so i can't judge.
speedy's fail was, as you all know, motherboard failure. but that's less the manufacturer and more the model. it's a miracle that speedy's even still among us; her particular model was recalled due to it going up in flames in peoples' laps. (and i'm not talking a little smoke from the fan, i'm talking full-blown keyboard inferno. o__o; )
gothpod III's fail was that she just died. i was her third owner, and she was a 5th generation classic (30gb) that just eventually got old and died. i got gothpod II back and everything was hunky-dory. it was hard to get used to the space decline, but III was so slow and crashy that i actually welcomed the smaller II. :\
Tanky's fail was just that she's old and is slow. not much more than that. she's actually the most reliable of my computers outside of gothpod II, but since we live in a faster-paced world, she can't handle most web browsing tasks (unless i use her native IE6 browser, which isn't a bad thing, outside of the fact that it doesn't have tabbed browsing. how did we ever live without that?)
shitty's fail was similar to tanky's, only instead of it being due to age it was due to hardware constraints. that's what i get for trying to run XP SP3 with less than half a gig of ram. :\

in terms of preferred computer brands, i'm partial to HP and IBM (but only original IBM). I haven't tried some of the higher-end brands, but i've heard that ASUS and the more expensive Alienwares are pretty sweet.

[IanDanKilmaster]

As far as customer service goes, I will staple any company's balls to the wall when they fail to properly attend to their patrons' needs.  I remember the days when you bought something, you owned it, and no one tried to feed you this "you only purchased a license" bulls**t.  In that regard, I must ask everyone to pardon me if I'm overwhelmed with the so-called "typical American sense of entitlement".  All I ask is that when I, or any other customer for that matter, buys something, it works as promised, and if it doesn't, the person who made/sold it better be ready to answer for it.  I know it gets really old when you see yet another thread online bashing whoever for some sort of perceived wrong-doing, but at the same time, I think it's about time that each of us, as consumers, finally acknowledge to ourselves that we deserve better.  There was a time when we had rights, and it actually mattered when a company somehow deceived or abused their customers.  A couple of decades' worth of frivolous lawsuits have finally shot us in the foot, and we pretend like we're being whiny or bratty whenever we finally have worthwhile complaints to address.

Gah... sorry... this is just something that has been boring through my brain for awhile now, excuse my nerd rage.[/rant]

I won't thrash Apple any further on this as I think enough has been said, and the answer to this dispute between company policy and national law seems fairly obvious.  Other than that, I'd like to point out something I've heard about tech support - apparently if you choose the Spanish-speaking option, you'll actually get someone fluent in English.  I've heard that the operators for the customer help line en español are actually Spanish-speaking Americans (or English people, not really sure), humorously enough.

[Red-Machine]

why should i need the indian guy who's telling me to downgrade from windows 7 back to vista just to fix my webcam? >>;

You know, 7 works fine with Vista drivers, hell even XP drivers are fine.

[Chocofreak13]

@IDKL i feel your pain. these days instead of buying the cd you're buying a stupid code. and when it doesn't work, somehow it's our fault. >:\
@red: eh, everything on speedy worked perfectly with 7 EXCEPT the camera, and i could never figure out why. tbh, it was a small cosmetic issue, since i have an external webcam anyway. :\