95-sama

[Nuker]

So, you know, I was about to start a full-body drawing of 95-tan, when I looked at my previous drawings and realised they didn't give me a "95-tan vibe". They may have looked like 95 tan, but they "felt" like a random anime girl cosplaying as an Os-tan. So I tried to correct that, at least in part. I also tried to space the eyes out a bit more, as suggested.

Here's the result. You can consider it some sort of "remake" of my first drawing. As always criticism and comments are greatly appreciated.



I get the feeling I should color it. What do you think?

[C-Chan]

Yo Nuker,

I thought I saw some empathic comments from you a few posts ago, so it's comforting to know that's still going around to an extent.  I myself have long retired from artistic motivation -- worse now that the future of the forum is uncertain -- so understandably I'm a bit selective of what I comment.

I agree that your earlier two sketches were "stiff" which is indeed a common beginner's problem, but I would add that they were also conceptually stiff as well.  As you best described it, they were portraitures of some girl that had a bow and kimono resembling those of 95-tan.  Also, the face of the girl was also too elongated, the eyes catatonic, the nose large, the mouth too rounded, the hair timidly short (on the first one anyway), and there felt an uncomforting lack of emotion from a character that has already been built up by over 214 recorded picture:

http://ostan-collections.net/imeeji/thumbnails.php?album=5

...not including unrecorded pictures, Background pictures, Group pictures, and fanart of her in our User Gallery.

All these traits conspired to make the images not only stiff, but also distinctly Western  -- great for a Byzantine stain glasss window, but hardly what could be considered Anime/Manga after 1990.  In short, the images risked being labeled boring, and would probably not stand a chance in a real Image Board.

Having self-diagnosed the problem and rectified it considerably with the 3rd image is, in my opinion, a leap in the right direction.  I don't make it a point to criticize the artistic elements of a hand sketch since I myself am physically unable to handdraw in pen and paper (unless you can't market Parkensonian artwork, in which case maybe it can pass for that).  But from a conceptual standpoint, you've taken steps to ensure that you've not only drawn 95-tan, but that you've also tried to do your research too.  The lower half of the bow should be a little larger, you could use a little more hair on top and the nose could be a little smaller, but the head size is not as long, the eyes are smaller and doe-shaped enough to be characterically 95-ish, and you've remembered to include the glasses.  The drawing is not dynamic yet, but it does draw a greater amount of interest I feel.  Though I'm not sure he would agree, your 95-tan depictions are more closely approximating those of her former #1 fan Darknight:

http://ostan-collections.net/imeeji/index.php?cat=10274

I get the feeling I should color it. What do you think?

If you asked it that means you want to, so don't ask just go ahead and do it.  Especially if you intend to draw "Anime", you almost have to color it -- leaving it B&W is more the realm of more elaborate Manga artwork.  `v'

I myself specialize more in digital coloring and shading, special effects and vector graphics artwork, so if you approach the job utilizing either of these methods, you can be sure I'll critique up to your eyeballs.  MWAHAHAHA!!  `v'

In general, though, I take a very laissez-faire view of the actual artwork itself, since it's sufficiently subjective-enough to determine only a portion (albeit one of the most noticeable portions) of an Anime's success.  
CLAMP artists love to draw their characters with stilts for legs, twigs for fingers and other anatomical defects, and yet we love them to bits.  Deja Vu made the richest, most beautifully drawn OS-tan comic I've ever seen, and yet we hate their guts.

Along with the artwork, you have to consider story, context, emotion and marketability.  And certainly in our more personal environment, your own personality figures greatly into the equation as well, even if we may not realize it.  With so many drawings out there, why should yours be the most interesting?  What does it have that sets it apart from simply copy-catting off Japanese artists?  Why should we even waste our time and finger muscles typing any kind of response for it?  If you're serious about drawing Anime, never forget to ask yourself these questions regularly.

Indeed, Anime artwork is not mutually exclusive of all these things, but an integral part to the symbiosis we call "Anime".   Without it, Anime artwork would be just a collection of lines and pretty colors.

And don't forget that Anime art, unlike Manga, is not generally considered "good" artwork.  Having to put up with production deadlines and costs, you may realize that Anime characters are shodily drawn, with flat shading, simplified anatomy, extensive use of shortcuts (e.g., Action Lines), and angular drawing styles that are nowhere near as realistic as the rounded styles of older Disney animated movies....



Yet we WORSHIP Anime, consider it a SUPERIOR art form, and are entranced by its stories, complex characters, clever use of context, admirable use of lighting, and jaw-dropping special effects (especially in newer series like Kanon or Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya).

I can't find a better example of "Doing More with Less" than Anime, and you'd be well served to keep that in mind as you continue what I hope you will commit to become your ienvitable evolution to artistic greatness.

[VonDaab]

Oh wow, wall of text. Pretty harsh text too.

Anime characters are shodily drawn, with flat shading, simplified anatomy, and angular drawing styles

I see you havent watched Cartoon network(or other amerikkan cartoon channel) lately...


Also, what? "forums future uncertain"? What is this?

so understandably I'm a bit selective of what I comment.

I dont understand, why are you selective?

C's text:  "We,we,we,we"

Please, dont generalize people.



The glasses really gives her the true "95-sama" feel.
Nevertheless, this picture is pretty much identical with the older one, therefore I got no fresh critique...
Only that your scans are really, really 'light', hard to see you know...



Sorry for going bit offtopic.

[C-Chan]

Also, what? "forums future uncertain"? What is this?

Long story,... but as far as things are concerned, we're practically headless at this time.  Had it not been for a tactically-deployed email on my part, the hacked forum might have remained perpetually online.  I'm sufficiently PO'd to not really care about it anymore.  Â¬Â¬

[Nuker]

C-Chan, thank you. I really, really aprreciate your post, your criticism and your suggestions. I don't know how to reply to your post without writing an huge wall of text, and since it's late in the evening where I am, and I am bit too tired to write a 1-page post, I'll just say that I'll keep your post in mind and I'll take it to heart. May it guide me in my quest for artistic prowess. :-)

[C-Chan]

Certainly my friend.  ^^
You're not obligated to write a wall of text, so don't do it if you don't want to -- just the fact that you read it all thoroughly and didn't misunderstand any of my points is 'thank you' enough for me.  Believe me, only a handful of people in this forum traditionally read beyond the first few lines of my posts.  -v-

If anything, using the time to color your drawing, or to draw another character, is probably better.  Go forth and conquer!  ^___^

Oh, and have a good night!

(btw, with a name like Nuker, I'm thinking of nicknaming you "Microwave")  ^v^

[Nuker]

Microwave-san, uh? Sounds surprisingly good! XD

I'm reading Thurosis' manga right now (too tired to do much else), but I think I'll go to sleep in a matter of minutes. So good night to you too. Or good afternoon, or good morning, or whatever time of the day it is where you live

[C-Chan]

Fufu... well, it's "good evening" by now for me too.  ^.^;

Aaaaaaaaah,... Thurosis-san, now that's a name I've not heard in a looong time... a long time.....  ^^

Funny thing is, when he first came here, he was very much like you.  Well no, not quite -- artistically-speaking, he already drew tons of stuff prior to coming here.  But his perceived shortcoming was confidence, and it was a HUGE impediment -- suffice to say, he seemed like an insecure and nervous wreck when I first met him.  And yes, at one point he also asked (begged?) to be trained in Anime artwork presumably to improve his drawing style.  I believe the old thread is still around:

http://ostan-collections.net/topic-423.html

Wow, now that I look at it again, I think i also gave him the same Wall O Text treatment too.  ^__^

In any event, I gradually convinced him that he actually had a fairly good personal art style going, and that he would be better served taking that to new heights rather than start from scratch learning Anime cel-shading.

And he did, and not long after that started drawing his OS-tan Collections comic, which was so full of humor and wit and many many Easter Eggs based on careful observations of our members... the fact that he did it quickly and with passion was quite invigorating.  ^.^

It wasn't without its faults, though -- he never could detach himself entirely from his favorite Anime influences, so story-wise the comic eventually lost some focus and became "Code Geass Part Two".  -v-

But that didn't matter -- what mattered was that his self-depracation was finally dispelled and he finally acquired some semblance of pride as an individual (and by association, his artwork).

He disappeared for a while, and came back a changed and rather happy young man, having won a comic contest in Germany among other things I can't remember.

After that I never saw him again, but there's no doubt in my mind he's doing well.  Though my life here in OSC has hardly been without sadness and hardships, it always brings me joy to remember the few times I could actually help people help themselves.  I consider confidence to be the second best and most universal gift you can give to anyone.  ^^

First place being food..., ^____^

*stomach grumbles*

Hehehe... ^^;

Now then, let's get back to 2008 and Microwave-san....  -v-

===========

So far as I can piece from your introduction, you have confidence, you seem to have patience, and you're gifted with courtesy and an appreciation for wit.  ^^

On the other hand, you claim to lack practice drawing in this style.

Out of all the hardships that you could encounter in life, this is actually nothing.  Rest assured, you can draw in this style, and you WILL draw in this style, and perhaps much sooner than you think.

The question therefore is not whether you CAN draw/sketch/color/etc it, but HOW you plan to do so -- and certainly if you will permit me I'll gladly offer both pragmatic and philosophical advice that may help you ask the right questions about methodology.  -v-

==============================

Just for some Food for Thought (although if this is morning for you, "Breakfast for Thought"), here's two tips that you might want to consider as you're drawing 95-tan or modifying the image a little or even if you're drawing something new:

1)  If you want to draw in the Japanese Anime style, it would help to have a specific series art direction in mind as your tentative goal/target (until, or if you feel the need to evolve your own style after a while).  Not only would it help me tailor additional pointers around this style, but it would help you self-study the imagery and really understand how an Anime character is created (and why particular design features were chosen and others not).

For example, this:

...is definitely not the same style as this:



But look carefully, and you will spot some common similarities.  ^^

And if you watch their respective series, you will understand why there's such a HUGE disparity in art quality, even though both series, I think, are excellent.  ^___^


2) If you have not done so already, consider putting on some music appropriate to the character as you draw her.  If artwork is the body of Anime, music is its soul -- as long as your body absorbs the gentle melody, hyper-happy rhythm or electrifying beat of the soundtrack you've chosen, you may inadvertently pass on the emotional charge onto your creation.

At the very least, it will get the creative juices flowing, as the song or music may undoubtedly inspire mini fanfics of the character in your head, which in turn will give you the urge to draw more to bring that imagery to life.  ^^[/list]

That's all I can say for this morning -- hopefully it will be of some help.  ^^

[Nuker]

I tried to draw something. It's not really dinamic, but it's hopefully a bit less stiff and has a bit more 'personality'. C&C appreciated as always.

That thing behind her back (not the one behind her head) is another bow, it's not evident because the scanner ate the lower portion of the image. I should color it to make it more clear.




Talking to Toshiaki? Arguing with her younger sisters trying to explain USB to her? Challenging Mac-tans? It's up to you, but the message is the same: "Well then, let's see you do it!"


Btw, you are indeed authorised to laugh at those poor chibified excuses for hands that are at least partly hidden by the kimono.

[VonDaab]

Oh, more new stuff.

Alright, my opinions:
The lineart is a bit jaggy. Practice drawing long complete lines, for a lot smoother result.

And now theres that common problem with beginner anime art: her eyes, they arent really aligned correct. It looks like she's staring into emptyness, like not concentrating at anything.
Moving them bit closer to each other might help things.

Yeah, her arms look bit wonky. Do you draw anykind of bodystructure like stick or bubble figure before making final lineart?

Uh... that's all from me for now.


Oh yeah, btw, when are we going to see full body drawing with legs and all?

[C-Chan]

Btw, you are indeed authorised to laugh at those poor chibified excuses for hands that are at least partly hidden by the kimono.

[sarcasm]HAHAHA! I'm gonna laugh at Microwave-san for doing something I do 80% of the time!  ovo[/sarcasm]

No but seriously, if you genuinely don't want to do something or don't have the time to work on it, I'm not gonna condemn you for employing a creative technique to just bypass it altogether [for now anyway]  Crossing the arms is a common enough pose that I wouldn't have been able to tell anyway had you not drawn attention to the fact (another common technique is to use any number of hands-behind-your-back pose).

It's still not a color offering so I can't add more to what's already been said about the drawing quality.

Context-wise, however, you fixed her head bow, lengthened/beefed up her hair significantly, emphasized the kimono a bit more, added the kimono "bow" (for lack of the actual word for), and used an even more 95-ish expression, with that polite scowl of hers that speaks volumes in itself.  In addition to the small premise teaser (I'd opt for her thinking "let's see YOU draw me better than this" ), you've also begun "inking" your drawings -- by that I mean supplanting the pencil-drawn storyboard feel with a pen(?)-drawn appearance that boldens the lineart and generally gives the final image a cleaner more professional feel.  I do agree it is somewhat jaggy, but it's a start.

All in all, you're keeping a very steady, incremental pace of improvement.  But I rather hear some sort of commentary from you, since I still have a relatively poor idea of what your goals are, if any.  

[Nuker]

The lineart is a bit jaggy. Practice drawing long complete lines, for a lot smoother result.

Will do. Or I'll just vector the lineart to death. Either way, I'll get better.

And now theres that common problem with beginner anime art: her eyes, they arent really aligned correct. It looks like she's staring into emptyness, like not concentrating at anything.
Moving them bit closer to each other might help things.

The eyes, the eyeballs, or both? Anyway it's difficult, because the eyes shouldn't be too close, and finding the place where the eyes are just at the right distance is no easy task. Will try, though.

Yeah, her arms look bit wonky. Do you draw anykind of bodystructure like stick or bubble figure before making final lineart?

Uh... that's all from me for now.

I did, but 95-tan's right hand overlapping her left arm kinda screwed everything up. Kimonos are also a bit hard to draw because of their huge sleeves.

Oh yeah, btw, when are we going to see full body drawing with legs and all?

Maybe when I can draw something halfway decent?

[VonDaab]

The eyes, the eyeballs, or both? Anyway it's difficult, because the eyes shouldn't be too close, and finding the place where the eyes are just at the right distance is no easy task. Will try, though.

Ah, I meant the irises/pupils, as in the direction the eye looks in.

Maybe when I can draw something halfway decent?

Still doesnt stop you from drawing fullbody pictures.

[Bella]

What a long, beautiful speech, C-Chan...I suppose I've never really had a set style to call my own. Like Nuker, when I came here I was pretty much a blank slate artistically. I had never made any serious attempt at Anime-style drawing before, so I observed others, asked questions and knew when to ask for help, and picked up stuff as I went along. Something needed more than talent is the ability to learn-- I don't believe I have any natural talent toward anything I've done, it's just a natural aptitude toward learning. That, and a lot of practice, is how I've managed to get this far.

Also, don't be afraid to try more stylized poses and designs. Try drawing a lot of little sketches, and work on capturing movement and facial expressions...I have TONS of quick, shoddy sketches lying around-- for every one drawing I've completed I probably have 20 sketches I've whipped up in mere minutes, to capture the sorts of emotions and expressions I associate with the character I'm drawing. Doodling is not only fun, but also very useful, and is probably one of the best ways to get better at drawing.

2) If you have not done so already, consider putting on some music appropriate to the character as you draw her. If artwork is the body of Anime, music is its soul -- as long as your body absorbs the gentle melody, hyper-happy rhythm or electrifying beat of the soundtrack you've chosen, you may inadvertently pass on the emotional charge onto your creation.

At the very least, it will get the creative juices flowing, as the song or music may undoubtedly inspire mini fanfics of the character in your head, which in turn will give you the urge to draw more to bring that imagery to life. ^^

Hey, I listen to music too while drawing (sometimes). I usually find myself listening to alternative or indie rock/pop, J-Pop (which is odd, cause I can't stand pop usually), even classical music and jazz, it really depends on the character in question. Take that *Nix Holiday picture I drew last year...I was listening to Trans-Siberian Orchistra at the time. Or that VMS/eCOS-tan picture, which I drew while listening to harder rock (which usually isn't my thing, but really seemed to fit the spirit of the picture).  Some of my pictures even end up named after songs, like O Fortuna or Golden Days ^^

And yeah, it is funny how I'll start to think up little stories while listening to the music...

But let me get back on topic, to Nuker's newest drawing...

It's a step in the right direction. Like I said before, you should consider doing more quick sketches, though. As for the lineart being a bit rough, this was always the problem I had with hand-drawing, and was the one thing that motivated me to learn vector art more than anything else. The eyes are a bit off, but not by much; again, I didn't draw pupils on my characters for a long time because of this problem, too. I do think you've done a good job at capturing 95-tan's attitude, though.

[Nuker]

Ultra quick post: The most jaggy part of the outline, the one under 95-tan's right hand, was a 30 second on-the-fly correction done with a mouse (not a tablet) in photoshop. No surprise it looks ugly