FOSA Preamble

[C-Chan]

Well the "Anime" part of the title was really just to distinguish it from "Art", but no real intention was there to actually make it a full-blown Anime.  In theory its' possible,... but not as a forum thread.  ^___^;

Similarly, the copyright issue was brought up IN THE EVENT a full length anime was created that gain some sort of notoriety.   Fanfics and fanart, I doubt, are of much scale to cause any problems.  Then again, if you get used to drawing FOSS-tans, then you'd never have to worry about that ever (aside from the whole education thing, since FOSS projects really do deserve more exposure).  -v-

Believe you and me, I'd love to do an Inkscape-tan.  Problem is,.... I draw a complete blank whenever I try to brainstorm concepts.

I don't know whether to make her a mountaineer or a calligraphist, or what....

But I'll save that for another thread.  ^__^

[Bella]

Well said, CC, and I totally agree with you! I'll admit that I've never quite cared if the world accepted my artwork; the one person whom I most want approval from is myself. I guess it's also been a way for me to further explore different OSs and combine this with my love of drawing. I guess it's also good that I, and we, may be bringing a bit more exposure to old OSs that are all but dead or forgotten...

About the pilot run, it succeeded. Honestly, I didn't know how it'd work out, but I think this shows we can work together and get something done. In the future we may have to do layers as separate documents, and combine them into one finished picture or something like that..

As for the Inkscape-tan...someone's already done one on DeviantArt...

[C-Chan]

Well said, CC, and I totally agree with you! I'll admit that I've never quite cared if the world accepted my artwork; the one person whom I most want approval from is myself. I guess it's also been a way for me to further explore different OSs and combine this with my love of drawing. I guess it's also good that I, and we, may be bringing a bit more exposure to old OSs that are all but dead or forgotten...

Thank you, Bella-sama.  ^^
And yes, I nearly forgot,... aside from FOSS projects, we also actively encourage remembrance of legacy systems that helped shape the world we live in today.  We'll always hold the likes of VMS, Multics, and Amiga in our hearts now.  ^___^

About the pilot run, it succeeded. Honestly, I didn't know how it'd work out, but I think this shows we can work together and get something done. In the future we may have to do layers as separate documents, and combine them into one finished picture or something like that..

Yeah, once we have a good infrastructure in place, I think we can experiment with all kinds of different approaches.  In the meantime, while we get that set up, let's go ahead and hone individual team efforts.  ^^

As for the Inkscape-tan...someone's already done one on DeviantArt...

WAIIIIIIIIIIIIII!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  AWESOME FIND!!!!!!!!!!!  ^V^
Sufficiently Moe,... Pigtails,... Mountains,... Ink.... Monochromatic appearance + colors,....

Yeah, she not only has the full package of references, but she saves me a whole lot of trouble too!!  ^___^

Three things to do going forward:

1)  Load her up in the Gallery
2)  Save a spot in the Wiki for her
3)  FANART!!!!!!!!!!  ^V^

*C-chan wags tail with excitement*

[Kiso]

PAP Palnt
Now -that- is what I call art... but then again... art is art wherever you see it. Still, heavy artwork... both literally and figuratively. *thumbs up*

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@Bella: If only you knew that I am like that... I don't really care who likes it, I draw what I feel like drawing. If I don't like what I do... I never get to complete it, or won't like the work no matter how much other people think it is good or whatever.

@CC: I will not answer most of that stuff because I do not want this thread to turn into a flame war or [software/stuff]-bashing or something similarly uncalled for... we are all here for the art, if we can agree on that... there's no need to care about people's thoughts and preferences unless it involves they choosing their environment and the tasks they do.

However, I will say that I am as good a defender of software as well as a good disser/basher/flamer/whatev of one... I mean, I have proprietary software that I like more than GNU ones... but I also have GNU stuff that I like more than proprietary. I got my hands on Autodesk 3DS Max, because people said it was the best thing to ever come out... until I got my hands on Lightwave 3D, its non-image based GUI was much more intuitive to me than 3DS ever was... so I shoved my mouse up that software's behind and booted it off my PC. Then along came Blender 3D... the software has by far a lost of features and stuff I wanted that weren't available in LW... and I liked it a lot... very easy to use (contrary to most people who say it isn't, no good 3D software is easy to use on the first tries). But the program was too powerful for my laptop (I couldn't create complex stuff without making my system go slow and a times simply crash the Blender program).

So... I simply kept going with Lightwave because it was more system-friendly than it's somewhat more superior GNU counterpart.

--- --- --- --- ---

Inkscape-tan
Wow... I was going to do one of that as my second project to the Vistan sisters... I was horribly beat in terms of timing. Oh well there a lot of fish in the WWW to make tans out of.

Anyone ever thought about OpenOffice.org or...?

*keeps shut before he gives to many ideas for drawings and ends up doing nothing new and "innovative" (not sure about being innovative)*

[C-Chan]

I while ago I was somewhat "commissioned" to do an OpenOffice-tan, which I insisted actually be a full suite of OpenOffice-tans (Writer-tan, Calc-tan, Impress-tan, Draw-tan, Base-tan, Math-tan).  

As you might have noticed, that particular project has been delayed indefinitely.  Certainly wouldn't mind a taker if you're interested.

Added after 33 minutes:

If only you knew that I am like that... I don't really care who likes it, I draw what I feel like drawing. If I don't like what I do... I never get to complete it, or won't like the work no matter how much other people think it is good or whatever.

BTW, sorry if does sound like I'm flying in the face of everything you truly stand for deep down inside.  Believe me, I know how that feels.  

However, do try and put yourselves in our shoes.  You've been a good contributor and a great "anglist" (is what I'm calling you), but in all honesty I barely know you and almost 80% of everything you've said in the last couple of posts seems to fly in the face of what most of us stand for here.  I'm not sure just how acquainted you are with the OSC culture -- but as with any culture, it's in your best interest to learn as much about it beforehand before immersing yourself in it.

Otherwise, you'll end up literally and figuratively with "culture shock".

I'm a strong believer in the Golden Rule, "Do onto others as you want others to do onto you".  Do everything in your power to appreciate our work, and we'll do everything in our power to appreciate yours.  That's worked well for over a year now, to the point where I myself have drawn well over a dozen Windows-tans to honor the interests of my peers.

[Kiso]

The O3 Team
Actually... I thought of that also... your idea of a team of Software-tans to represent the multiple programs that O3 offers. I guess they'd be one of the best friends of the Unix family of tans... If I thought about it that way... lol

The Golden Rule
You know... I agree with that uhm... golden rule (though I know it as "Don't do to other's what you would not like to be done to you.") ... and quite honestly, I appreciate your (everyone's) work. If I were to say... I guess I should be grateful to you (CC) for leading me to Inkscape even. I have seen your work and found more than what I intended to come look for. I had no idea that open sourced tans existed until i arrived at the site, about a week before I joined (yes, The Kiss read up on some stuff before joining mainly this board and the one on top of this one).

I had stated before that I prefered to draw original characters rather than the ones that are famous... kind of the reason why I wanted to draw Vistans instead (though now taking reference of already existent ones) of other MS-tans or Mac-tans... and then there's the possibility of making(drawing/illustrating/sculpting/whatever) even more original tans with the still "untouched" softwares like O3... even in a world that purely fan-based I chosen to go with something that is uniquely of my own design (again, tentative exception is Vistan) over the desire to draw an already settled-down character.

"Culture Shock"?
Uhm... I don't know what that phrase means... but I guess I can leave it undefined. I don't really want to know how much close to it I am.

Hmm... final note... I think.
Can we simply lay off the rather off-topic talk? I mean, like I said before... I don't want to drive off the thread from it's real intent. If you ever wanted to discuss things like these... a debate or talk thread can always be opened up on matters such as the ones (I think) this current coversation is based on.

....

Hmm... llevar la fiesta en paz es dificil cuando se es totalmente neutral o indiferente al mundo que te rodea.

[C-Chan]

No need to, I think all outstanding matters are settled.  Also, the Pilot Run is done, so the FOSA Preamble has served its purpose -- once the FOSA site is set up, we can retire this thread for good.  ^^

You seem to me like  a fine and reasonable person, so why don't you try out some other threads in the meantime,...?  Give you time to soak in more information and deal with other personalities besides this CC guy?  ^__~

Creeame que me da cosa que te quedes enserado aqui en un solo lugar, debatiendo con un cochinito!  No me suena ni lo mas minimamente saludable!  ^v^

*laughs at own bad joke*

[Kiso]

Uhm... one word... "multitask". *does that a lot*

[Bella]

My stand: We should try and use art, and this project especially, as a unifying medium. It doesn't matter what OS you like or your views, if you can bring something...anything...and are willing to learn and challenge yourself, then I think this is a great project for you.

That said, I can see where Kiso's coming from; I mean, I'm probably one of the forum members here most interested in designing -tans for ancient OSs; I'm not a Windows fan by any stretch of the imagination, and almost exclusively draw new OS-tans, yet my first OS-tan pieces were almost exclusively fanarts of Windows-tans (including...*gasp* two Vistans!) and Mac-tans, with the occasional Distro-tan. Only after I felt comfortable with my artwork, did I attempt to personify more obscure or undrawn OSs...

As for the OpenOffice-tan, I know Siya did a RedOffice-tan...but if you've got some ideas, I'd love to hear them! Though the "OS-tan conjecture" thread is really the best place to throw around ideas for -tans...

[Kiso]

Well Beauty (yes... Beauty instead of Bella)... I don't know squat about O3 other than it being quite the threat to MSO (Microsoft Office) software... in that sense, they would be not so much different than their proprietary counterparts. However, I would have to test it for myself in order to get a clear picture of what this officie suite can really dish out.

[C-Chan]

Oy, I feel like we're moving backwards, not forwards.  -___-

Okay, we have been discussing this for near 3 pages now, and while I don't want to stretch it out further than it has, it's not really off-topic since it still ties directly with what I'm trying to establish with FOSA.  That being said,... I understand I may not be always be clear about what I say, because I've grown used to people around me knowing what I say and filtering out the jokes from the more serious matters, so I'll proceed to summarize my position very slowly, very calmly, and devoid of nonsense....

I made it a point in my preamble to say that animation is "theoretically" possible for a very specific reason.  The system I had designed for still images is meant to be as unintrusive and simple as possible.  You have one single program you can all use, only 1 hour to work on said contribution, and complete freedom to draw what you want.  Yes, it's meant to establish teamwork and unity, just as long as people adhere to it as a simple and fun pastime.

However, this does not translate well with more complicated material, such as a game or an animation.  A timeline is required, specialized software is required (and in some cases even purchased), and some scheduling/delegation would be necessary.  Add to that the fact that a substantially greater level of team cohesion has to exist in order to prevent the project from disintegrating, as well as all the hundreds of man-hours and training needed to complete something of this scale, and you have in your hands something that is inherently intrusive to the lives of the participants.

Not to say we can't do it.  Clearly there are lots of people who work on things like these.  But ask yourselves this....

If you're going to be working on a complex project such as an animation or game,... AND you're aiming to garner it some kind of worldwide exposure as has been suggested... then I RECOMMEND that you stick with something that's both safe, useful and sustainable.  By safe I mean not having everyone spend countless hours of time pouring their hearts and souls into a project that would inevitably either land them in legal danger, or force them to lose it.  By useful I mean something that would have intrinsic worth to society, so that we don't look back several years from now groaning that we spent so much time and energy on something that no one would remember.  And sustainable in that the project goal must be of intrinsic value to oneself, so that it lends a "drive" for the individual participants to work long and hard.

I threw in the FOSS examples to stay within topic, but in reality it could be something unrelated to OS-tans at all.  

When I was intending to leave the forum last year, I wanted to pursue programming so I could create a Japanese language learning game (GPL'd of course) and put my skills to even better use.  This was of course back when I took my forum life too seriously for my own health, so when the likes of Bella-san helped me rediscover the "fun" of it,... well,... you see I'm still here.  But I have not lost sight of that original dream, and I still practice programming every once in a while so that,... when I inevitably leave this forum,... I can spend my "retirement" building something that kids, language enthusiasts and Anime otaku will all find fun and useful.  And yes it'd be cross platform -- as long as people LEARN and are willing to educate themselves, I don't care what system they use.

Now if I recall, I said "recommend".  Probably because this is my FOSA thread, you feel that everything said by me is written in stone and that's the end of it.  But I'm not going to tell you what to do, so if you do want to pursue this individual dream of yours, then more power to you and I wish you good luck.  What I'm letting you know is that, unless this "Escalated FOSA" meets the prerequisites I just established, then I'm sorry to say I don't think I would be able to join you, and I certainly wouldn't feel right to commit anyone under my project leadership either.  With all due respect, that's simply well beyond my intended scope.

I'm sorry again to have to end things like this, when of course you've all participated so willingly and enthusiastically in this project.  I still don't want to deem it a failure, so I'll just say that this is simply a way of "feeling out" some pitfalls that we may encounter.  If the pitfalls persist, though, perhaps I may not be the best suited to found this project -- or we're simply not ready for it yet.

[Dos]

Don't give up c-chan you can do it eye of the tiger
"give c-Chan a fresh bake cookie
-Dos

[C-Chan]

*rubs DOS-chan's head playfully*

Thank you.  Don't worry about a thing.  ^^

[Bella]

*pops in*

C'mon people, we needa lighten up! And keep it simple! At first of course...

*Bella out*

[Kiso]

*sneaks in*

Well Beauty... I learned to not take things seriously... that's why I keep most of my mind off the talk if it is not direct and literally related to the topic at hand... as expressed with my intent to drop the talk on some of the stuff up there.

But now that that may be aside... here's my skill checkup report... I converted one of the raster images I presented in the first page and want you people to see how good I have done... well... at least I think it is good. ^__^'

Anyways, here it is:

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