Teenager problem

[Gummster]

Let's talk about teenagers. Two days ago I was teaching a group of teenagers, they were generally rude and not very thankful that I flew over to the other side of the country just to teach them (and for the little amount of money I was paid to fly over there). I noticed especially they like to complain about every single detail, they quit before they even try. I also noticed that they think that they are superior, they acted like I was nothing, ignoring me and insulting. There was only one kid that appeared to have some manners, she was treated like garbage among the others. I decided to take her to a special lesson as she showed some promise, there I learned that she was bullied everyday, not just mentally but physically to, Just because she's from Denmark, just because she was slightly different. And this is not the first time I get this kind of attitude from teenagers.

Tell me what is becoming of today's youth? When I was a kid the first thing that was focused on me were my manners, and discipline! And there was only nine years age difference between us. How did this happen!? How the hell (pardon my language) did this come to be!?

[Pitkin]

Not meaning to undermine you in any way, Gummster-san, but I personally do believe the teachers have lost a lot of the authority they used to have back in time. Why I think this is because during my time in both elementary and high school there were one or two teachers who absolutely _dominated_ the class so that the ill-mannered pupils didn't differ from the well-behaving ones at all. They all had in common their age (55+), and strong temperament; just their plain presence in the classroom made everyone calm down. I guess that the discipline in general has grown less strict (and teaching methods softer, not a bad thing), but don't know if that is to blame, especially for bullying.

Younger teachers have it a lot harder, developing the authority; young women have it the worst, having to hear obscenities along the usual blah-de-blah. This is all according to my own first-hand experience from the early 1990s to early 21st century.

Bullies have always existed and made the lives of others living hell. Kids (up to high school without doubt, many people continue even through all their lives) are just so bloody opportunistic that they take any chance to boost their own status in the class.

I myself was a good student, and also bullied, but that's neither the topic here, nor do I want to go into details of that.

[NejinOniwa]

Hmm, well...

What you are saying is a perfect example of the generally lowered respect and worsened attitude among today's youth. I mean, when I was in elementary school we hardly dared to look at our senpais - but before I had even turned 15, younger students all over were playing "point 'n laugh" at the older students like me. It's true, we're facing a generally worsened grade of common respect, courtesy and everything in this age.

[Gummster]

Yes the fact that teachers are getting softer is a fairly good reason. The main cause of me getting so shocked is that I was born and raised up in a small countryside/forest society where this didn't exist, and as I grew and went to different schools I was still oblivious of bullying, and the only people I hung out with in high school were fairly sophisticated well mannered students, and by the time I was in the university everyone was too mature to do these kind of things.

Well I at least think that teachers should get their stuff together and begin their evil reign once more.

[NewYinzer]

I think the problem is societal (in the United States). A lot of it rests in parenting and materialism. Parents want the best for their kids, but are oblivious as to how. Some neglect their kids, resulting in teenagers who don't care and seem to bully out of emptiness. Some parents care for their kids too much, resulting in teenagers who have a hard time standing on their own two feet and are angry out because they are cared for too much. Some bully to seem tough and gain acceptance. Others bully out of jealously. As for bullying and disrespecting authority, it's because there is no discipline. Corporal punishment is as rare as the "Made in USA" label nowadays. Our society has gotten too soft, and thus our kids run wild. Parents are afraid of everything - from rap music, to soft drinks, to occasionally disciplining their kids. Discipline is important - no matter what Dr. Phil says. I really do not know too much about Europe, so I really can't gauge the situation over there. But here, society is a mess. Back in the days, before the sixties, kids were happy. Although they lacked material goods, they went outside, had fun, and problems were few. Although material goods are plentiful now, one can see that problems have gotten worse. Face it - in a country where the two guiding principles are "reverse discrimination" and "greed is good", there's bound to be problems. Right now we've got school shootings, marijuana use, lawsuits over the stupidest things, and obesity. The curse of capitalism has reached down to our children, but in a country synonymous with "success", it can't help but have problems.

[CaptBrenden]

bring back capital punishment if you ask me.

[Pitkin]

bring back capital punishment if you ask me.

Err... I don't think in any society kids have been executed for behaving badly... since the Middle Ages, I mean. ;018

As for NewYinzer-san: with your comment on the 'softness' of the US society, I couldn't disagree more. Material values (common to the whole occidental world), the huge pressure on the 'do I look good' side, and the US culture in general is the _definition_ of hard society without _any_ soft values to me personally. Soft values are things like 'time spent together with family', aesthetics, and solidarity; if I'm not mistaken, the whole US society is going to the totally opposite direction, precisely because of the "greed is good" principle. Naturally, not being a US citizen I'm not as well aware of your culture as you are, so I wouldn't mind being corrected if I've gone wrong. However, I hope I don't spark any kind of overly-patriotic defence speech either, as those I'm not interested in (from anyone, not Finns either :p).

The whole talk about 'how kids were happy in the 1950s' is also a myth; there were bullies back then just like today, but back then it wasn't computer games blamed, but instead rock music, and phenomena new to that time. Children's interests were different for sure, but I personally cannot agree further.

edit: After consulting my political advisor, I guess I'll have to add that I do realize that Europeans and Americans look at the society from two very different points of view. Therefore, I hope no one from the western side of the Atlantic take any offence from my words.

[zjhentohlauedy]

I'm not so sure about the bullying stuff, i never really experienced anything bully related. i studied in elementary and high school in a small Christian private school. we were around 300 - 350 students, a single section per level. yup 300-350

but now that i'm in college it's a very different thing, students disrespecting professors and such, those guys just get to my nerves.

you can't blame computer games and such because almost all of us at the university are exposed to those kinds of things, it even seems that most gamers and otakus i meet are the decent ones.

i'm not really sure what causes teenagers to be that way since everyone i'm close with are decent(heck they don't even smoke or drink, Our only drug is Anime and games!)

[Kami-Tux]

I think the problem is societal (in the United States). A lot of it rests in parenting and materialism. Parents want the best for their kids, but are oblivious as to how. Some neglect their kids, resulting in teenagers who don't care and seem to bully out of emptiness. Some parents care for their kids too much, resulting in teenagers who have a hard time standing on their own two feet and are angry out because they are cared for too much. Some bully to seem tough and gain acceptance. Others bully out of jealously. As for bullying and disrespecting authority, it's because there is no discipline. Corporal punishment is as rare as the "Made in USA" label nowadays. Our society has gotten too soft, and thus our kids run wild. Parents are afraid of everything - from rap music, to soft drinks, to occasionally disciplining their kids. Discipline is important - no matter what Dr. Phil says. I really do not know too much about Europe, so I really can't gauge the situation over there. But here, society is a mess. Back in the days, before the sixties, kids were happy. Although they lacked material goods, they went outside, had fun, and problems were few. Although material goods are plentiful now, one can see that problems have gotten worse. Face it - in a country where the two guiding principles are "reverse discrimination" and "greed is good", there's bound to be problems. Right now we've got school shootings, marijuana use, lawsuits over the stupidest things, and obesity. The curse of capitalism has reached down to our children, but in a country synonymous with "success", it can't help but have problems.

Sorry, I would comment but first want to know whether that was trolling or not... and need to do homework.

[Thurosis]

The same here in germany ! The students are getting more and more worse!

They are a lot like in the first post that you discribed -.- The thing that   
provoke me the most are the manners and how they speak (in now days)

I have the feeling that they can't speak their native language (mother tounge)

the other thing is : they never try, most of them gave/give up before they even try to do it ...

If this continues the world will be gone soon -.- (Okay i know this too extrem)

[Gummster]

If this continues the world will be gone soon

That's exactly true, if there are none who have no future ambitions and just care about the now (not that caring about the present is bad, just only caring about the present) It'll only get the world to decline.

you can't blame computer games and such

Tell Jack Thompson that.

[Kami-Tux]

The same here in germany ! The students are getting more and more worse!

They are a lot like in the first post that you discribed -.- The thing that   
provoke me the most are the manners and how they speak (in now days)

I have the feeling that they can't speak their native language (mother tounge)

the other thing is : they never try, most of them gave/give up before they even try to do it ...

If this continues the world will be gone soon -.- (Okay i know this too extrem)

I am just reminded of a line in a song in Kölsch:

...weil der Ã,,rjer von hück - und es jeit flück - die joode alte Zick von morje is...

(...because the problems of today are the good old time of tomorrow...)

Things like Klassenkeile (the entire class teaming up against one poor sod) or horrible pranks existed already when my parents were young.


Also, IMHO the majority of people are and were not smart or interested in knowledge - not just today but at all times.

[CaptBrenden]

Tell Jack Thompson that.

we dont speak his name here.

[IanDanKilmaster]

Tell Jack Thompson that.

I think even the people who support his cause think he's Postal.

As for NewYinzer-san: with your comment on the 'softness' of the US society, I couldn't disagree more. Material values (common to the whole occidental world), the huge pressure on the 'do I look good' side, and the US culture in general is the _definition_ of hard society without _any_ soft values to me personally. Soft values are things like 'time spent together with family', aesthetics, and solidarity; if I'm not mistaken, the whole US society is going to the totally opposite direction, precisely because of the "greed is good" principle. Naturally, not being a US citizen I'm not as well aware of your culture as you are, so I wouldn't mind being corrected if I've gone wrong. However, I hope I don't spark any kind of overly-patriotic defence speech either, as those I'm not interested in (from anyone, not Finns either ).

I think you've generally got the right idea, but I really don't think society is that much to blame, to quote Bender, "Most, if not all the blame lies with the parents".  Instead of taking personal responsibility for how their children behave, most parents would rather place blame on video games, music, movies, or TV for being too violent.  Now while I can't argue that the overuse of violence is corrupting the arts, I don't think it's the primary reason the kids here are all effed up.  The sad reality of this world is, violence is just a fact of life, it's always going to be here, nothing will change that.  The problem is, I really don't think most parents have bothered explaining that properly to their children, they'd rather leave that to the media... which is a seriously, seriously bad idea (TV was never meant to be a babysitter).

As far as discipline goes, I really don't think going back to the dated method of corporal punishment is really going to solve much of anything, I believe there's a reason that our society moved away from that to begin with and that it only served to promote more violence.  It breeds fear and contempt, not respect... I know this first hand.  What's more important is teaching a healthy amount of self-discipline and responsibility, that way, when the kid grows up to be an adult, he's not left totally aimless when he's out on his own and without someone lording a stick over him.  In this world, there's a natural set of consequences to each action and bringing a belt into it only introduces an unnatural consequence to something that should be taught as common sense.  Let me be clear, I'm not one of those people who think parents should let kids to whatever they want, parents should assert their authority in the house, but I think there are much better ways than corporal punishment.

Sorry for getting so far away from the main point of this forum, so I guess I'll get to this disrespect issue.  Going through HS, I also noticed how entirely disrespectful the generations below me were getting, it was atrocious.  I think the reason why so many kids are so disrespectful is because they haven't received the right amount from their parents themselves.  Kids are either neglected or treated like dirt or their being spoiled rotten by parents who don't know how to say "no".

This is all just my opinion of course.

[Gummster]

or their being spoiled rotten by parents who don't know how to say "no".

I think that has it's truth in it, I've seen loads of parents who give their kids whatever they want, like it's impossible for them to say no. But that is another example of lack of discipline, parents should be able to say no!