/OSC/ Skypetable RPG - Changeling: The Dreaming (2nd Edition)

[NejinOniwa]

PROTIP: Making your players ragequit is not the goal of the game. Good day, demon is out and away from this game.

[Chocofreak13]

*sigh*

it has come to my attention that some of you have a problem with me. more specifically, how i run my games. here is a post to address these issues:

legal vs illegal moves:

just because you don't like something doesn't make it illegal. using glamour to counteract a cantrip? legal. counterweaving a cantrip? legal. soaking damage? super legal. these are the rules set down in the book, and in my games. if you don't like a move, yelling and screaming about how lame it is doesn't do anything but serve to make you look like an idiot.


is the dm's character a player:

yes. despite what you may think or may have experienced in other games, this one is real. White Wolf games are quite, quite different from other roleplay systems. This isn't D&D where i tell you about a dungeon and you go fight in it. Changeling and WW games in general are so much more than that. the system of play and rules are simpler than D&D, but this makes the game much more complicated. the plot aspect is much harder on me as the coordinator, as with D&D you have no choice but to stick around in the dungeon or similar area. here in changeling, you have so many more options, that i stick you with a guide to make sure you're not just wandering around aimlessly. you may call me controlling, but if i didn't give you a goal to follow, we wouldn't be doing shit, we'd just be rambling on like what happened in the Gender Flipped RP. without a target, the gun has nothing to shoot. without a goal, we have nothing to play.

i'm sure i could be an omniscient, unnamed presence in this game, but that's not how i roll. i've been doing this for years and this is the first time i've gotten a complaint from my players. actually, most people have regarded me as a better storyteller than usual for this game due to the balance of combat vs RP.

also, for the record, I'M NOT A DM. THERE IS NO DUNGEON TO MASTER. I AM A STORYTELLER. there's a big difference there. you got a problem with any of these statements, read the damn book. i have cover to cover 4 times.


"bashing down [the players'] every attempt at doing something out of line":

i'd like specific examples on this. if you're talking about when people got teleported back into the subway, just think of all the video games where you try to swim/walk/fly out of the predesignated area, and are blocked by a force field or something similar. the platforms were not a defined area at that point, thus your characters could not access them.

if you're talking about countering something in battle, i refer you to the "legal vs illegal moves' section.

if anyone has more examples on this, i'd love to hear them.

while you're allowed to mastermind and engineer every single aspect of the game, don't expect your players to like it"

this one actually makes me laugh. have you EVER experienced a game where you liked EVERY aspect of it? if so, i'd like to hear about that game, since i figure it'd be interesting to propose to my class. one of the things we discussed there was the value of conflict, both directly in the game and even with the game itself.
for instance, you may not like every mission in GTA, but you still play, because it's a cool game and some of the missions are fun.

if i sugarcoat it to the point where players will like EVERY ASPECT AND IT'LL BE SO NICE AND FUN AND HAPPY, then it will be the most stupid, arbitrary game that ever existed. another thing we discussed in class was keeping games from being too arbitrary, as the more they are, the less fun they are. (example: tic-tac-toe and its constant stalemate)

if someone is going to ragequit just because they've encountered something they don't like, maybe they shouldn't be playing in the first place.

dragging things out
whether it's due to complaints, things needing to be explained, or extended break time (or something else), no one likes it when play drags on. it makes the game tedious and difficult to play, and it's detrimental to the game itself. if you have a beef with something, wait till a break or after the game to voice it; wasting time that could be better spent playing is counterproductive. we're here to play, after all.

'Astrid just outright attacked us'

no, no she didn't. i gave you warning.

[3/3/2012 7:16:23 PM] chocofreak887: As they approach, the broach they received from Ed begins to glow, and the nearby supernaturals scatter. Before they realize it, they are being attacked.

even before i posted that you were getting your weapons ready. Astrid didn't even act till the last turn! that was PLENTY of time to formulate actions, so this argument is quite invalid.

you throw lame Banality in my face when i do something nice

i refer you to the legal vs illegal moves section.

you came out of nowhere and went "LOL ULTIMA SPAM"

i haven't the slightest clue where you're getting this from. Astrid's stats are balanced, unlike some of the players who decided to put their characters on battle mode steroids. she's a troll, so obv. she's going to be physically strong. she's a lady, so she's experienced in combat. and she's a fallen princess, so she has some powerful magic under her belt. these are all within character and all legal. and for that matter, SHE was the ONLY one who received damage! she attacked someone a couple times, mostly unsuccessfully. she cast an art twice, leading to someone being frozen (ONCE) and a cantrip being frozen. other than that, she mainly just held her ground.

as for her freezing a character in place, this didn't even do any damage, really. and you all had plenty of opportunities to get him out. he could have screamed (would have been muffled by the ice but it would have been audible), he could have wiggled around to try to loosen the coating, or another player could have stepped in to try to break the ice, melt the ice, or get their tongue stuck to the ice like in It's A Wonderful Life. you are only limited in your actions by your imagination (provided you run anything crazy by me first; all of those things would have been acceptable solutions to your problem). it's all about THINKING OF IT.

if you think i godmodded anything, well, i'd call you mistaken. but even so, it's my job as the coordinator/storyteller to have a little more power. after all, if you had just knocked Astrid flat on the ground, the game would have ended there. however, Astrid as a character is no more overpowered than any of you. on the contrary, i'd argue that some of you are more powerful than she. for example, she only has one art, one realm. she has no merits. she knows nothing about computers or how to persuade people. everyone has their strong suits. it's all about being patient enough to see them shine.

It's not like you came out of nowhere and went "LOL ULTIMA SPAM", like he seems to claim
You gave us fair warning, we brandished our weapons, and prepared for what was coming

if anyone has any more issues with me, please, SAY THEM TO MY FACE.

now then, while we're on the topic, my issues with all of you! ^^

backseat DMing

whether or not you own up to it, if you tell me how to do my job, this is exactly what you're doing. mind you, while i'm not a DM, it's the same principle here as it is in all tabletop games: telling the person how to do their job is NEVER a way to garner favour. if you have an issue with how i do things, how about you try running a game yourself?

and for that matter, it adds insult to injury when i'm getting feedback of this nature from people who've never run a White Wolf game or never run a game in general.

peanut-gallery

this ties in with the former post! getting heckled is never fun, especially when i'm in such a precarious position as it is. what seems to you like "harmless feedback" is to me "HEY, YOU SUCK AT THIS, DO IT THIS WAY". all feedback should be left for during breaks or after the game anyway.

not having your own opinion

don't say you have an issue with me and then don't back it up, or worse yet, get someone else to back it up for you. how do i know how you REALLY feel if you just jump on the bandwagon of another's thoughts? never mind that you won't be able to articulate those thoughts unless you say them yourself.

making/assuming opinions for others

another frustrating one! don't speak for others. instead, encourage them to speak for themselves. provided they remain open to discussion and retain a calm, rational attitude sans sarcasm or snark, i'm always open to feedback. it's when people attempt to browbeat me into doing something either by attempted intimidation or, more commonly, fast-paced arguing (aka not letting me get a word in edgewise), or get their panties all in a bunch over things that are trival or that i won't do that i don't want to talk to you. taking an attitude with me isn't good. SPEAKING ALL IN CAPS ISN'T GOOD. fucking swearing every other fucking word isn't fucking good. speak in calm, concise sentences with clear arguments, and i'll be perfectly willing to talk about gameplay issues with you.


that sums up this post. if you have anything else to say and are going to say it like an adult instead of a child's tantrum, then i'll listen wholeheartedly. i'm doing this because i wanted to have fun with everyone. i've devoted weeks of my time to this (mostly in class!!!) to make this game kickass, and if i get nothing but whining and grief from everyone, i'm not going to do a damn thing for you anymore. why should i spend my time on this if it's just gonna come back and bite me in the ass?

- 光♠

[NejinOniwa]

I could comment on the various modifications you've done to make your statement seem more viable, but I won't. You have zero capacity to listen and accept any sort of assessment of flaws given to you. I will thus not bother to give you any more than what I've already done, since it'd only make us both angrier and feed the internet yet another rage rant, of which it has all too many already.

You made an effort, it fell back on you. DEAL WITH IT, IT HAPPENS. You wanted to have fun, some did, some did not, some choose to complain, you rage. DEAL WITH IT. Not gonna do another damn thing? WE WILL DEAL WITH IT. No matter what happens on any sort of personal level, the world and the rest of the people will go on. Ragequitting excludes YOU from the group and the activity, not the activity from the group. You Are Not The Center Of The Universe.

Finally,

if you have an issue with how i do things, how about you try running a game yourself?

You might have noticed a certain effort of mine to do this (including translating much part of a damn rulebook), that went about before winter, but died because I respected people having exams and whatnot, and when I suggested reviving an RP effort, it was ramshodded into this one instead.

Stop making an even bigger ass of yourself than you already have.

[Chocofreak13]

*slow clap*

i'm trying to be mature here. calling me names isn't exactly what i'd call mature.

as for your mutant game, i have my character ready. i've been waiting for word on that game for months. however, when i was saying "run a game yourself", i was referring to one of the White Wolf series, since you seem not to believe me when i say they are RADICALLY different from other systems, esp. D&D.

I could comment on the various modifications you've done to make your statement seem more viable, but I won't. You have zero capacity to listen and accept any sort of assessment of flaws given to you. I will thus not bother to give you any more than what I've already done, since it'd only make us both angrier and feed the internet yet another rage rant, of which it has all too many already.

you didn't read my post at all, did you? i'm willing to listen IF YOU'RE GOING TO BE COHERENT. this includes being calm and ceasing the snark and name calling. this also includes making a CLEAR argument. i couldn't understand half of your arguments because they were so damn vague.

You made an effort, it fell back on you.........rest of the people will go on. Ragequitting excludes YOU from the group and the activity, not the activity from the group. You Are Not The Center Of The Universe.

when did i state that last part? no, seriously, WHEN? cause i don't remember it and i don't remember anyone besides you making that claim.
as for the ragequitting bit, the only one excluded is YOU. YOU'VE excluded yourself from this simply because you didn't win something. if you'd stuck around instead of chucking your script to the ground and storming off like a primadonna, you'd have seen that Astrid froze you in place to have a PEACEFUL resolution to the conflict. that said, ragequitting serves no purpose than to turn the quitter into a martyr. the rest of us had fun. the rest of us plan to have fun next week. whether or not you're part of that group is for you to decide.

give me a call once you grow up, please. in the meantime, we're going to be playing the game i've laid out. we'd love to have you join if you can handle it.

[Nichi]

So, are we doing this same time as always? I'll be out of town in the morning tomorrow, but I should be back in time to play if everyone else is ready to go

[Chocofreak13]

i'd like to know who is going to show up. the mopey part of me thinks no one will. :[

[Bella]

Have you heard from any of the other (non-OSC) players?

[Chocofreak13]

alex and jack: can't make it.
donovan: MIA.
melissa: haven't heard otherwise so i'm assuming yes. but i'll ask.

[Nichi]

Ok, my trip out of town is currently in decision at the moment, but my chances of being here for our game is looking very good

[Chocofreak13]

i'm not expecting miracles here. >>;;

[Nichi]

Huzzah! Trip out of town was postponed until another day.

Consider me to be there for the game :3

[Chocofreak13]

:3

[LadyJackthePirate]

I sadly cannot make it next Saturday as I have to work from 2-9pm. We figured out a way for me to be able to come and go because my new job (Walmart) wants to see how I react to different times. I am going to prove (without looking foolish) that I a much better daytime/afternoon person then a night girl so I can make it to game. Also, this week was Kari's birthday, so let us all wish her a Happy Happy Birthday, yes even you Nej, deal with it. *puts foot down* Big sis says be nice and work it out; because you are family and you aren't getting rid of us that easily. !

[stewartsage]

Wait, did I already wish Kari a happy birthday?

.....happy birthday Kari.

[Chocofreak13]

thankyou :3

for those of you not there, we postponed this week. let's hope for better next time. :[